After 12 years and nearly 500 episodes, the podcast Switched on Pop has become essential listening for anyone who wants to understand how pop songs work. Hosts Nate Sloan and Charlie Harding obsessively dissect chart hits, from the music theory behind them to the production tricks that make them shine. The show recently made the leap to video on Netflix, with guest appearances from Aaron Dessner of The National, Trevor Horn of The Buggles and Yes, and Cypress Hill. In a conversation with The Verge, Sloan and Harding talked about the tools they can’t live without, the tech habits that frustrate them, and a mutual obsession with guitar pedals.
Asked about their most indispensable tools, Harding pointed to his Martin D-28 acoustic guitar, the instrument heard on classics like “Blackbird,” “Wish You Were Here,” and “Big Yellow Taxi.” He found a 1970 model in an antique store in Maine and is still waiting for it to produce a timeless classic of his own. Sloan, meanwhile, said he can’t truly understand a song until he transcribes its melody, harmony, and rhythm using Sibelius notation software. Harding also added that keyboard shortcuts and the app Rectangle save him hours each year by handling the mundane task of repositioning windows, which he says makes him feel like he’s running mission control.
When it comes to phones, Harding’s biggest complaint revolves around iOS focus modes. He relies on them to block distractions, but family members are exempt so they can always reach him. Unfortunately, that means any group chat containing one family member can set off notifications while he’s presenting to a lecture hall full of songwriting students. His recently retired father, for instance, sends an urgent ping every time he catches a fish. Harding says he’d rather hear about those catches after 5 pm, when he’s off “do not disturb.” “If this makes me sound like a curmudgeon, I am.” Sloan’s phone wish is more whimsical: he’d like to strum it like a guitar.
The two differ wildly in their open browser tab habits. Harding had 92 tabs open at the time of the interview, neatly organized into groups that only he understands. Sloan keeps just two, having once kept hundreds open until he realized it was destroying his attention span. He now makes a point of constantly closing them.
When asked about their most used social platform, Harding said he’d pick browsing Sweetwater, the music gear retailer, for variations of guitar pedals he already owns. Sloan said he spends time on YouTube watching ukulele tutorials.
Harding’s favorite gadget is the Dato DUO synthesizer and Dato DRUM drum machine, which he calls the easiest way to learn synthesizer programming. “You can’t make a bad sound,” he says, adding that his kids jam on them every night. The result, he laments, has turned them into Brooklyn DJs. Sloan holds his 2006 iPod in the highest regard, the one he traveled around the world with.
Asked what he wishes he had created, Harding recalls pitching friends in 2007 on an app that would let people legally hitchhike in other people’s cars. The group started a tea company instead, which Harding says was ultimately less of a liability.
Both are proud of their creation, Switched On Pop. Harding’s wife suggested he also mention their children. Sloan is proud of coining “pop drop,” the term for the instrumental postchorus in pop songs. He also says he’s proud of getting dunked on by YouTuber Rick Beato after calling the Jonas Brothers “stupefyingly funky” in The New York Times. Harding, at his wife’s prompting, adds his guitar pedal collection.
The best advice Harding ever received: “You can never have too many guitar pedals.” Sloan’s answer to the same question: LeBron James signing with the 76ers.
When Sloan needs to focus, he steps away from his computer, takes a walk, and starts recording a voicenote about what he’s trying to accomplish.
The last physical media purchase for Harding was “The History of Sound” by Ben Shattuck. Sloan bought a vinyl copy of the Jeff Parker IVTet.
Harding doesn’t hesitate when asked what’s worth splurging on: “My guitar pedals. And my beautiful wife.”
If a biopic were made about him, Harding says the tagline would be that he’s embarrassed there is a biopic about him. Sloan’s would be: “One man dared to overanalyze pop music, taking on BTS Army, Madonna stans, and the Little Monsters, and living to tell the tale.”
Switched on Pop is a production of New York Magazine’s Vulture and the Vox Media Podcast Network. New video episodes are available on Netflix.
